Hi All,

I am part of a team setting up a new travel website and one of our aims is not to rip people off. We therefore do not want to profit from telephone calls. However, we must have a portable number.

As I understand it, 0870 is bad, 0871 is terrible and 0845 is OK. Is this correct?

When I have looked around at the numbers available from various websites, they have a very limited range. I want a memorable number or maybe even a particular number (e.g. 0845 vacation) - where can I get one from?

Thanks,
Ben

Good point, but I think that the answer is no.

Your options are to have a geographical number or a freephone number. Ofcourse, freephone numbers are chargeable from most mobiles, so it may be worth considering whether that would be worth it.

0845 is like a lower rip-off of 0870. 0844 and 0871 have various rates, 0871 being upto 10p/min at all times and 0844 being upto 5p/min at all times. Rates quoted are from BT landlines. These numbers are always chargeable, even when on inclusive call packages, and this is one of the core problems with 084/087 numbers.

If we could get a geographical number into our building (and it would cost us more than a non-geo due to the internal setup of the telephone system) what would be the peak, off peak and weekend call comparison costs between 0845 and 0207?

Are most consumers savvy enough to understand the difference between geo and non-geo? I wasn't until recently and I wonder whether Joe Public thinks 08xx numbers are higher profile than geo numbers..???

wrote on May 3^rd, 2005 at 7:47pm:

If we could get a geographical number into our building (and it would cost us more than a non-geo due to the internal setup of the telephone system) what would be the peak, off peak and weekend call comparison costs between 0845 and 0207? Are most consumers savvy enough to understand the difference between geo and non-geo? I wasn't until recently and I wonder whether Joe Public thinks 08xx numbers are higher profile than geo numbers.

Depending on the caller's service provider, the cost of calling an 0845 or 0870 number varies.   HERE IS A GOOD SUMMARY of what some charge.

As most people still use BT, their charges for calls to geographical (01 or 02) numbers are probably most relevant for comparison:

0845 - 3p/minute 0600-1800 Mon-Frid (5p minimum charge)
0845 - 1p/minute at all other times (5p minimum charge)

0207* - 3p/minute 0600-1800 Mon-Frid (5p minimum charge)
0207* - 5.5p for up to an hour at any other time

* or any other 01 or 02 number

However, many of us now use different call providers and pay much less.  I, for example, use 18866 and pay 2p for a call of any length at any time to any UK 01 or 02 number (i.e. 2p per call, not per minute) and so strongly object (in fact, don't call) to firms using 0844, 0845, 0870 and 0871 numbers.

Beware, Martin Lewis has just taken up arms in this regard (see HERE) and Britain's rip-off culture with such numbers is about to become HIGH PROFILE.

Three other points you should consider before you go down the NGN route.

1.They dont always work from abroad.

2.Ofcom and the ASa now advise you to tell the customer the true cost of the call in any advertising.

3.Calls to them tend to be dearer from mobiles,and payphones.

I am sure BT would give you a nice Geographic No if you asked them.

As Bill said i think the shi-- is about to hit the fan about  the use of these numbers.

Have been investigating costs with BT...

Call forwarding on a geo line:
£50 connection, £106 per quarter and the forwarded part of the call.

0845:
3.5p per minute to both caller and us

0800:
4.9p to us

This makes the geo too expensive. 0800 would encourage callers too much and tie up our call handlers. Realistically, we are therefore looking at 0845 or 0844. Is one better than the other?

Thanks,
Ben

I would go for the 0845 number. People think these are local rate.

I wouldn't choose the 0844 people are unsure what type of number these are.

wrote on May 3^rd, 2005 at 7:41pm:

0845 is like a lower rip-off of 0870. 0844 and 0871 have various rates, 0871 being upto 10p/min at all times and 0844 being upto 5p/min at all times. Rates quoted are from BT landlines. These numbers are always chargeable, even when on inclusive call packages, and this is one of the core problems with 084/087 numbers.

With Eurexcel 0844, 0845 and 0870 are included.

Only on 2 of there packages!! and probaly not for much longer now that Carphone Warehouse have bought them!!!

Ben.
If you do decide to go down the 0845 route, there are  suppliers other then BT that want charge you anything to provide,rent, or for the calls.

diytravel...

You need to DUMP "normal" phone systems and think VoIP (voice over internet). This is the way the whole world is going.

I run my whole business over VoIP. I just have a broadband connection and I pay £10 (YES TEN POUNDS) a month for UNLIMITED calls to over 21 countries (inc the UK). Quality is fantastic - often better than a normal phone line.

ANYWHERE in the whole world I just plug into a net connection and all my calls on my 020 7 number are routed to me FREE wherever I am. I have multiple incoming lines; free rental and free purchase of 020 numbers (or anywhere else in the UK). I even have FREE numbers in the USA and worldwide clients can call me on.

I also have hunt groups; voicemail to email etc...

I have NO hardware - just VoIP phones and a net connection.

NORMAL PHONE SYSTEMS ARE DEAD

0870/0845 ETC... ARE DEATH. I NEVER CALL THEM!

Hi PeDaSp,

We are investigating the pros and cons of VoIP...
* We hear of unreliability, dropped calls and poor quality... have you experienced any of this?
* What big businesses have gone for VoIP?
* Why wouldn't a big business go for it?
* How big is your business in terms of numbers of telephone call handlers?

Any info much appreciated.
Thanks,
Ben

I suppose that I should ask why you need a portable number. Then I will put my thinking cap on in case there is an easy and friendly solution - there could be and the VoIP one is also valid. The world is improving and, of course, BT's notwork will soon be entirely IP based...

And, of course, the technology is now the same for diverting numbers, just a little (OK, big) matter of milking the profits.

* We hear of unreliability, dropped calls and poor quality... have you experienced any of this?
Depends who you sign-up with etc... and what system you use. All depends on who the VoIP provider uses to "break" out into the PSTN world.

* What big businesses have gone for VoIP?
Name one that hasn't! They've been using VoIP for years. Goldman Sachs was the last one I read about.

* Why wouldn't a big business go for it?
No reasons.

* How big is your business in terms of numbers of telephone call handlers?
5 employees at the moment.

Any info much appreciated.

Take a look at: http://www.voip-info.org

Scroll down to where it list's VoIP consultants.

How many people in your business? Let me know and I'll outline a solution.

Peter

Hi Peter,

We are 2 employees now and will be 4 by August. If we can get a VoIP provider that gives us a business SLA that would be great. And is it worthwhile backing up the broadband connection with ISDN?

Thanks,
Ben

Email me on: gruntlespam<at>yahoo.co.uk. Replace <at> with "@".

Then I will email you my number and we can chat. No charge  ;D

After several months of setup we finally launched our travel website and used a geographic VoIP number so that people wouldn't be ripped off when they called us.

Thanks to all those that helped!

Ben
www.diytravel.co.uk

Just a thought. Now that you are using a GN, why not promote this by adding a note to say that as a company, your policy is not to use "premium" rate 0870/0871 numbers? Some of the more experienced saynoto0870 members would, I'm sure, help you with the correct wording. This should pour cold water on your competitors who do! Bill

My suggestion would be a freefone number and geographical equivalent, for example:

"Call us free on 0800 XXX XXXX. Calls from mobiles to this number may be charged at a higher rate. Please feel free to call us on 020 XXXX XXXX"

Alternatively for 0845:

"Call us on 0845 XXX XXXX. Most phone providers don't include 0845 numbers in their inclusive call packages. Please feel free to call us on 020 XXXX XXXX"

Just my 2p. Awaitin' a slatin'.

Oops. Posted then realised there was a second page that I didn't look at.

Definitely waiting for a slating.

Rich