0800 numbers, often as a gesture of goodwill from companies, are a complete pain in the backside, if like me you only have a mobile. 0800 numbers are not included in my allowance so I have to pay extra.

Now here is a good example of good customer practice - Wandle Housing Assocation publish the 0800 number on the website, then say if you are calling from a mobile then you call the 020 number instead, which they then list.

This saves both them and me money - an absolute no-brainer! How can we encourage more companies to do the same?

Perhaps you would like to spare a thought for the charges those people calling you are incurring due to them being unable to telephone you on a geographical number.

Dave wrote on Jun 18^th, 2008 at 8:05pm:

Perhaps you would like to spare a thought for the charges those people calling you are incurring due to them being unable to telephone you on a geographical number.

Fair comment, but Im rarely at home so having a landline would be a waste of time. If anybody calls my mobile from a landline I call them back with my inclusive minutes. As for businesses calling my mobile, I rarely give them my number anyway.

On the subject of calling 0800 (and other freephone) numbers from mobiles, are you aware of the 020 dial through numbers you can use?

Dave wrote on Jun 22^nd, 2008 at 2:25pm:

On the subject of calling 0800 (and other freephone) numbers from mobiles, are you aware of the 020 dial through numbers you can use?

Does anyone know which charity provides this service and how it could be encouraged to promote itself more widely, so that all those who publish 0800 numbers could be advised to make mobile callers aware of this most valuable philanthropic gesture? or is this just a commercial loss leader that would disappear if too much attention were drawn to it?

I'm guessing if they are a telco they actually make a very small profit on the service as aren't telco's paid to deliver calls to 0800 numbers, ok it's likley to be very small amounts but hopefully it is a viable service (although not going to pay for the christmas party).

Finarea (18185 etc) does not offer calls to 0800 numbers. Presumably this is because Finarea has no way of collecting any of the ppm that the called party pays to the terminating provider. All this reinforces the point that 0800 numbers are costly for called parties, and pointless, or near-pointless, for most callers. Possible exception: little old ladies who are still on BT's light user tariff?

nicholas43 wrote on Jun 23^rd, 2008 at 6:20pm:

All this reinforces the point that 0800 numbers are costly for called parties, and pointless, or near-pointless, for most callers. Possible exception: little old ladies who are still on BT's light user tariff?

Back to my question - How can we encourage people to publish the geographical equivalent of their 0800 numbers? After all, it costs them money to receive the call and for those of us out and about using mobiles, they are pointless.

Dave wrote on Jun 22^nd, 2008 at 2:25pm:

On the subject of calling 0800 (and other freephone) numbers from mobiles, are you aware of the 020 dial through numbers you can use?

I have heard of them but have not found any that work. Could you advise me of some please?

Thanks mate

Fusion wrote on Jun 25^th, 2008 at 1:23pm:

I have heard of them but have not found any that work. Could you advise me of some please?

They are 020 0222 0900 and 020 0222 0700.

Fusion wrote on Jun 18^th, 2008 at 1:43pm:

if like me you only have a mobile. 0800 numbers are not included in my allowance so I have to pay extra.

Where do you use the internet then if you don't have a phone line or any broadband?

Also surely there are still quite a few phone boxes knocking about.  Calling 0800 from one of those is still free even though calling 084/7 numbers from a phone box is very, very expensive.

Am I right in thinking that calls from a phone box to 0800 are hugely expensive to the called party, and that therefore some users of 0800 numbers bar calls from phone boxes?
As to how we encourage well-meaning users of 0800 to publish a real number too, dunno. Ask them every time you phone, and keep pointing out that it would both save them money, and help people calling from mobiles?

nicholas43 wrote on Jun 28^th, 2008 at 4:49pm:

Am I right in thinking that calls from a phone box to 0800 are hugely expensive to the called party, and that therefore some users of 0800 numbers bar calls from phone boxes?

Not unless things have changed.  0800 calls work fine from phone boxes as far as I am aware.

Surely an 0800 call from a phone box is either free, or charged at geographic rates. The inbound call (to the recipient of the 0800 call) would be charged at their provider's 0800 inbound rate (probably a few pence a minute) - it doesn't make any difference to them if the caller is calling from a normal landline, phone box or mobile phone.

nicholas43 wrote on Jun 28^th, 2008 at 4:49pm:

Am I right in thinking that calls from a phone box to 0800 are hugely expensive to the called party, and that therefore some users of 0800 numbers bar calls from phone boxes?

From BT Price List:

http://www.serviceview.bt.com/list/public/current/Call_Charges_boo/2-0020_d0e5.htm


Quote:

Subpart 1:Telemarketing Services Freefone, BT 0845, BT 0870, BT Contactcall 0844 and 0871, BT Call Director Services & BT 03 […] Payphones There may be an additional charge per minute (in addition to the pence per minute rate set out in the Order Form or Charges Schedule as appropriate), for Calls to freephone numbers originating from public payphones, managed payphones and renters' payphones. This charge relates to the payment of a Payphone Access Charge as published by BT.

[edit]This quote is to service providers and is in connection with incoming call charges.[/edit]

So does BT now charge or not charge for calling 0800 from a Payphone then?  "may" does not really help us.

I suppose they might now charge their 30p per minute connection fee then nothing per minute but I can't really see them doing this for something like the AA breakdown number.

I believe BT are or were conducting an experiment in to different payphone prices in different sorts of locations that good old Ofcom gave them permission for............

NGMsGhost wrote on Jun 30^th, 2008 at 11:03am:

So does BT now charge or not charge for calling 0800 from a Payphone then?  "may" does not really help us.

No. They are free as they always have been. See this post I made the other day explaining this.

Dave wrote on Jun 30^th, 2008 at 11:22am:

No. They are free as they always have been. See this post I made the other day explaining this.

You didn't mention the cost of 0800 numbers from Payphones in that post but in your other post in this thread you said they may be subject to additional charges according to the BT price list.  But obviously in reality that higher cost only relates to possibly calling 0800 numbers on a private payphone and not a BT one out in the street.

NGMsGhost wrote on Jun 30^th, 2008 at 12:15pm:

You didn't mention the cost of 0800 numbers from Payphones in that post but in your other post in this thread you said they may be subject to additional charges according to the BT price list.  But obviously in reality that higher cost only relates to possibly calling 0800 numbers on a private payphone and not a BT one out in the street.

If you follow the link to BT Price List Payphone rates you will see that 0800 and other freephone numbers are free to the caller.

The quote above in this thread relates to service providers who operate 0800 numbers. It is they who "may" be charged.

Dave wrote on Jun 30^th, 2008 at 12:21pm:

The quote above in this thread relates to service providers who operate 0800 numbers. It is they who "may" be charged.

What do you mean by service provider though?

The originating telecoms company from the 0800 number that is called.  Or the telecoms company for the call centre receiving the call.

NGMsGhost wrote on Jun 30^th, 2008 at 12:42pm:

What do you mean by service provider though?

I understand Ofcom terminology to refer to three parties: OCP, TCP and SP.

1. The Originating Communications Provider is that on whose network the call is originated.

2. The Terminating Communications Provider is that on whose network the call is terminated.

3. The Service Provider is the organisation whose services are accessed by the call.

These terms are used when revenue sharing is involved.

The SP is a customer of the TCP. The caller is a customer of the OCP and the SP.

Where the service is designated as a "premium rate service" the SP becomes a communications service provider and thereby falls within the scope of Ofcom's regulatory powers (subcontracted to PhonePay Plus).

With 0800 numbers called from phone boxes, the supplementary charges may make the SP a customer of the OCP.

Please correct me if I have this wrong, although I make this posting with some confidence.

NGMsGhost wrote on Jun 30^th, 2008 at 12:42pm:

What do you mean by service provider though? The originating telecoms company from the 0800 number that is called.  Or the telecoms company for the call centre receiving the call.

As SilentCallsVictim says, the "service provider" or SP is the party receiving the call.

I am sure that calls to 0800 from a phone box are always free to the calling party. However, in my experience, some 0800 numbers which work from a residential line, give unobtainable from a phone box. I guess this is because the called party has to pay a hefty charge per minute for calls received from a phone box, and Dave's postings seem to confirm that. Likewise, prepayment cards allow fewer minutes if you use them from a phone box (assuming they work at all).

nicholas43 wrote on Jun 30^th, 2008 at 4:24pm:

I am sure that calls to 0800 from a phone box are always free to the calling party. However, in my experience, some 0800 numbers which work from a residential line, give unobtainable from a phone box. I guess this is because the called party has to pay a hefty charge per minute for calls received from a phone box, and Dave's postings seem to confirm that. Likewise, prepayment cards allow fewer minutes if you use them from a phone box (assuming they work at all).

It seems all companies offering 0800 numbers should have these limitations explained to them so that they will then also always provide a geographic alternative number to call them on too.

I wonder whether one can also call 00 800 International Freephone numbers from a BT PayPhone.  It would surely destroy one of their main purposes if one cannot.

NGMsGhost wrote on Jun 27^th, 2008 at 10:33pm:

Fusion wrote on Jun 18th, 2008 at 1:43pm: if like me you only have a mobile. 0800 numbers are not included in my allowance so I have to pay extra. Where do you use the internet then if you don't have a phone line or any broadband? Also surely there are still quite a few phone boxes knocking about.  Calling 0800 from one of those is still free even though calling 084/7 numbers from a phone box is very, very expensive.

I have web n walk on my mobile contract so I can hook it up to my computer as a modem - all internet usage is included in my contract and there are no limits on how much I use it.

Yep, I hear you about phone boxes but you are missing the point. 0800 numbers are great, but it is in everybody's best interests, business and consumers alike, if a geographical number is also listed as an alternative. This would not cost or hinder anybody - business would actually save money when people use the geographical number and consumers would save money if calling from a mobile. Its a case of having choice.

Fusion wrote on Jul 2^nd, 2008 at 9:48am:

I have web n walk on my mobile contract so I can hook it up to my computer as a modem - all internet usage is included in my contract and there are no limits on how much I use it.

I think you will find there are rather a lot of hidden "Fair Use" limits on how much you can download with WebnWalk!

I wouldn't even go near the BBC Iplayer website using WebnWalk.