SAYNOTO0870.COM - Earthquake disaster

joe65

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Re: Earthquake disaster
Reply #15 - Oct 12^th, 2005 at 7:33pm

[quote author=idb link=1129035386/0#3 date=1129038273]
The most offensive aspect, at least to me, about the use of 0870 in these circumstances is not the actual revenue payment derived from 0870 (which is probably refunded by BT anyway) but all the [b]extra [/b]revenue generated to other networks that charge forty or so pence per minute for such calls. Where will this revenue end up? Shareholders and fat-cat CEOs of course.

[/quote]

Hey idb, Who charges 40p/minute ?

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idb

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Re: Earthquake disaster
Reply #16 - Oct 12^th, 2005 at 7:37pm

[quote author=joe65 link=1129035386/15#15 date=1129141995]

Hey idb, Who charges 40p/minute ? [/quote]To be honest, I don't know as I haven't lived in the UK for a while. However during the discussion that took place after the London explosions in July, I believe this figure was what some pre-paid (ie pay-as-you-go) cellular (mobile) phone providers charge for such calls. I guess looking at the providers' web sites, assuming the charges are visible, should provide the information. Other contributors to this forum may have better information regarding specific rates. My '40p/minute' was just supposition but I believe it isn't far from the truth!

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joe65 Full Member Offline Posts: 143	Re: Earthquake disaster Reply #17 - Oct 12^th, 2005 at 8:00pm Thanks idb. Meanwhile, I've managed to find T-mobile on PAYG quoting 40p/min. So it's true, altho.' that's just 10p/min above their top PAYG rate to normal numbers. On Contracts they indicate 10p/min.
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NoNumberTrans

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Re: Earthquake disaster
Reply #18 - Oct 14^th, 2005 at 12:08am

Quote:

As for mobile operators charging for free numbers, I don't see why OfCOM isn't replaced by a proper hardline organisation and they aren't given the power to order them to change their ways or just shut the company down at the touch of a button. I'm sure this would sort out most of the problems we have in the industry at present. Oh, but that would be too much of a dictatorship wouldn't it? And we can't have that. Roll Eyes

This is slightly off topic but I guess Ofcom's defence is that there is competition in that for instance there is a mobile operator (Orange) who's 0800/0500 calls are free and who's 0870 calls can be part of inclusive minutes, though I guess the basic point is that its not clear to everyone when they choose their mobile operator....

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Mr_Asaboa Newbie Offline Posts: 28	Re: Earthquake disaster Reply #19 - Oct 14^th, 2005 at 12:18am Quote: Just watched the news. The appeal for help for the areas hit by this awful earthquake quoted an 0870 number, I'm disgusted. Somebody wants to make money out of even this. Surely it's not making money, but it's to cover the administrative costs of running a helpline??
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joe65

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Re: Earthquake disaster
Reply #20 - Oct 14^th, 2005 at 12:33am

It now seems widely understood that BT donate all their profits from providing the telephone service to the DEC appeal. After the Tsunami appeal this is reported as being a 6 figure sum.

What's not generally appreciated is, with the maximum transfer charge to the terminating phone company for delivering 0870 calls being ~ 5p/min and with originating phone companies charging their customers up to 40p/min for these calls, the 6 figure sum donated by BT may represent a 7 figure profiit being retained by the rest of the telephone industry and generated purely by the British publics response to the DEC appeal.

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NonGeographicalMan

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Re: Earthquake disaster
Reply #21 - Oct 14^th, 2005 at 8:46am

Quote:

Surely it's not making money, but it's to cover the administrative costs of running a helpline??

When people set up a phone helpline they should not expect to have its administrative costs paid by callers through a hidden charge most callers are unaware of because BT and other cynics in the telecoms companies are still misselling 0870 as being a national rate call.

They should cover these operational costs themselves and not try to recoup them as a further additional donation from those calling. If they want a donation from those calling towards their costs from the phone call they should be up front about it and use an 09 number which everyone knows is not a BT national rate call.

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bigjohn

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Re: Earthquake disaster
Reply #22 - Oct 17^th, 2005 at 12:49am

Quote:

This is slightly off topic but I guess Ofcom's defence is that there is competition in that for instance there is a mobile operator (Orange) who's 0800/0500 calls are free and who's 0870 calls can be part of inclusive minutes, though I guess the basic point is that its not clear to everyone when they choose their mobile operator....

Orange are going to start charging for calls to 0800 numbers from contract phones from the 1/12/05,and they do not include calls to 0870 or other NGN in their inclusive minutes.

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BJ.

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NonGeographicalMan

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Re: Earthquake disaster
Reply #23 - Oct 17^th, 2005 at 6:05am

Quote:

Orange are going to start charging for calls to 0800 numbers from contract phones from the 1/12/05,and they do not include calls to 0870 or other NGN in their inclusive minutes.

Are you sure? Mobile Phone shop salesmen have been telling me Orange is about to start charging for 0800 calls on their contract phones for several years now and it has continuously not come to pass.

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bigjohn Supreme Member Offline Posts: 2,316 Gender:	Re: Earthquake disaster Reply #24 - Oct 17^th, 2005 at 8:56am Quote: Are you sure? Yes starts on 1/12/05. Calls to 0500/0800/0808 on Orange Contract Phones will be charged at 10p a minute.Customers will be advised on next bill.I have discussed this in some depth with Orange on more then one occassion.
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NonGeographicalMan

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Re: Earthquake disaster
Reply #25 - Oct 17^th, 2005 at 9:29am

Quote:

Yes starts on 1/12/05. Calls to 0500/0800/0808 on Orange Contract Phones will be charged at 10p a minute.Customers will be advised on next bill.I have discussed this in some depth with Orange on more then one occassion.

So how come you know about it already if customers have not yet been advised?

What reasons are they stating for making the change? Presumably customer abuse in using it to call 1899 etc and avoiding making chargeable calls with Orange?

Still with the cost of mobile calls having fallen so much it seems stupid to make the change now when the amount of money they will lose through this will be less than it was in the past?

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bigjohn Supreme Member Offline Posts: 2,316 Gender:	Re: Earthquake disaster Reply #26 - Oct 17^th, 2005 at 9:50am Stumbled across this info Reason given to bring themselves in line with other providers.!!!!
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bbb_uk

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Re: Earthquake disaster
Reply #27 - Oct 17^th, 2005 at 11:03am

[quote author=joe65 link=1129035386/15#15 date=1129141995]Hey idb, Who charges 40p/minute?[/quote]Most mobile networks charge a set fee of around 35ppm but unlike geographical calls they do not go down after the first 3mins to a lower rate - generally about 5ppm, or in the case of t-mobile, may not go down after you have spent £10 with them like geographical calls do.

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NonGeographicalMan

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Re: Earthquake disaster
Reply #28 - Oct 17^th, 2005 at 11:13am

[quote author=bbb_uk link=1129035386/15#28 date=1129543413]
Most mobile networks charge a set fee of around 35ppm but unlike geographical calls they do not go down after the first 3mins to a lower rate - generally about 5ppm, or in the case of t-mobile, may not go down after you have spent £10 with them like geographical calls do.
[/quote]
There is no excuse for charging 0800s this way when the called party pays the cost of the call. The worst that should happen for 0800 is them being charged in the same way as geographic calls.

The mobile phone companies are behaving in a shameless cartel like way over NGNs that are nothing to do with their real costs. The real extra costs for 0845 and 0870 are the revenue share but on 0800 they face no equivalent revenue share costs. So the worst that should happen is that they charge them as per a geographic phone call.

If Ocom weren't so totally in the pockets of the telcos they would do something about this scandal.

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Dave

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Re: Earthquake disaster
Reply #29 - Oct 17^th, 2005 at 11:49am

Quote:

There is no excuse for charging 0800s this way...

NGM, I think you will find that this wasn't in response to the pricing of 0800 numbers, but of 0800 numbers.

There is a long thread on MSE about Orange charging for freephone numbers, but I don't suppose you venture in there. Roll Eyes

If you wish to discuss Orange charging for freephone calls, post on this thread, as we are going off-topic here.

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« Last Edit: Oct 17^th, 2005 at 12:56pm by Dave »

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