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A plea to 0870 (Read 12,855 times)
floella2
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A plea to 0870
Apr 16th, 2013 at 5:20pm
 
I know it is well intentioned but for gods sake please keep a regualr update on alternative numbers - there is 50-75% chance that the number will be useless -so total waste of time.
This is not something new but has been going on for ages -day in day out
Please get rid of the duff useless  alternative numbers
Does anybody check /update???
And don't ask me where these duff numbers are as they are everywhere -uitilities , banks, shops, support
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« Last Edit: Apr 16th, 2013 at 5:20pm by floella2 »  
 
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Heinz
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Re: A plea to 0870
Reply #1 - Apr 16th, 2013 at 8:26pm
 
Entries are mainly based on the work of site users and subsequent checking depends on reports from those who try to use them. 

If someone tries a number and finds it doesn't work, a quick report of that will save others the sort of frustration which you have obviously suffered.

When nobody bothers, everybody loses.
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After years of ignoring govt. guidelines & RIPPING OFF Council Tax payers using 0845 numbers, Essex County Council changed to 0345 numbers on 2 November 2015
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Dave
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Re: A plea to 0870
Reply #2 - Apr 16th, 2013 at 8:36pm
 
floella2 wrote on Apr 16th, 2013 at 5:20pm:
I know it is well intentioned but for gods sake please keep a regualr update on alternative numbers - there is 50-75% chance that the number will be useless -so total waste of time.
This is not something new but has been going on for ages -day in day out
Please get rid of the duff useless  alternative numbers
Does anybody check /update???
And don't ask me where these duff numbers are as they are everywhere -uitilities , banks, shops, support

These comments perhaps indicate the impending demise of the SayNoTo0870.com database of alternative numbers, if the experience is anything to go by.

Before I elaborate, I would like to point out that my input to the site is purely as a volunteer. I believe that a list of alternative numbers provides a service that is beneficial to telephone users and this is why I partake in helping find numbers and in maintaining the listings.

It stands to reason that the logistical task of maintaining an accurate and therefore effective service increases as the size of the database increases. This includes removing defunct alternatives as well as replacing them with new ones, as and when they may be discovered.

Visitors look up alternatives for no charge; that is they "take out" of the site for no charge. Where a user finds an alternative that is no longer of any use, notifying the site makes database adminstrators aware that the number requires removal.

Where a user decides to do nothing, fellow-users will be left to do exactly the same thing, which is to waste their time in trying a non-working number. The more this happens, the more the quality of the listings will fall.


Users who don't wish to "put into" the site, by letting it know about non-working numbers, may prefer a subscription service instead. Revenues could allow staff to be paid whose job it would be to check numbers. They would effectively be going along the same road as the site users who would be paying them.

There is clearly a demand for such a service, and I for one would be delighted if users that don't wish to help this site would create and subscribe to such an alternative numbers service.
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« Last Edit: Apr 16th, 2013 at 8:52pm by Dave »  
 
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CJT-80
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Re: A plea to 0870
Reply #3 - Apr 16th, 2013 at 10:20pm
 
floella2 wrote on Apr 16th, 2013 at 5:20pm:
I know it is well intentioned but for gods sake please keep a regualr update on alternative numbers - there is 50-75% chance that the number will be useless -so total waste of time.
This is not something new but has been going on for ages -day in day out
Please get rid of the duff useless  alternative numbers
Does anybody check /update???
And don't ask me where these duff numbers are as they are everywhere -uitilities , banks, shops, support


I think Dave's reply is well constructed and polite,  I on the other hand sometimes go for the more direct approach... How do YOU expect US to update the numbers if all you will say is that there are a number of duff numbers?  I am sorry but I do not possess a Crystal Ball.

I recently fed back that an alternative for Tesco did not work, it did't take me long to write up a post, in fact most likely less time than it's taken me to reply to this post which appears to be a rant!
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« Last Edit: Apr 16th, 2013 at 10:21pm by CJT-80 »  

Regards,

CJT-80

Any comments made are my own and are not those of SayNoTo0870.com
 
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floella2
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Re: A plea to 0870
Reply #4 - Apr 20th, 2013 at 8:37pm
 
Dave wrote on Apr 16th, 2013 at 8:36pm:
floella2 wrote on Apr 16th, 2013 at 5:20pm:
I know it is well intentioned but for gods sake please keep a regualr update on alternative numbers - there is 50-75% chance that the number will be useless -so total waste of time.
This is not something new but has been going on for ages -day in day out
Please get rid of the duff useless  alternative numbers
Does anybody check /update???
And don't ask me where these duff numbers are as they are everywhere -uitilities , banks, shops, support

These comments perhaps indicate the impending demise of the SayNoTo0870.com database of alternative numbers, if the experience is anything to go by.

Before I elaborate, I would like to point out that my input to the site is purely as a volunteer. I believe that a list of alternative numbers provides a service that is beneficial to telephone users and this is why I partake in helping find numbers and in maintaining the listings.

It stands to reason that the logistical task of maintaining an accurate and therefore effective service increases as the size of the database increases. This includes removing defunct alternatives as well as replacing them with new ones, as and when they may be discovered.

Visitors look up alternatives for no charge; that is they "take out" of the site for no charge. Where a user finds an alternative that is no longer of any use, notifying the site makes database adminstrators aware that the number requires removal.

Where a user decides to do nothing, fellow-users will be left to do exactly the same thing, which is to waste their time in trying a non-working number. The more this happens, the more the quality of the listings will fall.


Users who don't wish to "put into" the site, by letting it know about non-working numbers, may prefer a subscription service instead. Revenues could allow staff to be paid whose job it would be to check numbers. They would effectively be going along the same road as the site users who would be paying them.

There is clearly a demand for such a service, and I for one would be delighted if users that don't wish to help this site would create and subscribe to such an alternative numbers service.



Sorry if i came across as a moaning pratt Wink
2 suggestions
There should be a date as to when the number for  particular
organisation where updated
and a quick fix reporting solution
there should be a tick box  next to each number allowing users  to tick it against any potentially duff number.This tick would automatically go to Mods who could then check the number and remove if appropiate
Smiley
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CJT-80
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Re: A plea to 0870
Reply #5 - Apr 21st, 2013 at 12:54pm
 
Hi there floella2,

I am sorry if I came across a bit rude towards you.

I do however agree totally that there should be a reporting function that advises:
If the number still works, and when it was checked.
If the number does not work, and when it was checked, and also what happens when you call it.

It would also be useful to have a website that's accessible from a mobile phone.

However I believe that as this is run on a semi voluntary basis with little income except the advertising then it maybe something the owner is not inclined to do.
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Regards,

CJT-80

Any comments made are my own and are not those of SayNoTo0870.com
 
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loddon
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Re: A plea to 0870
Reply #6 - Apr 21st, 2013 at 5:47pm
 
This thread seems to have an unfortunate and confusing title.   Would it be more appropriate to call it "a plea to the managers of this website" OR "a plea for numbers to be kept up to date" OR similar.

By the way, Dave is quite right -- all the alternative numbers on this site are found by the users who take the trouble to send them in as well as corrections where they are needed.   Essentially we are a self-help community and it is up to us all to do our bit and contribute with knowledge, information, updates and corrections when we can.

I have always found the database to be a valuable resource and make a great deal of use of it, having not dialled an 084 or 087 number for years.   I accept that there are out-of-date numbers occasionally but that is no fault of the administrators and moderators who do a wonderful and voluntary job.   All credit to them.   We should all be immensely grateful.  Smiley  Many many thanks.  Smiley

I will go on to say that this Forum is also a tremendous resource with many people contributing their knowledge of the telecoms industry and interpreting events and announcements which I certainly find helpful and stimulating.   Most contributors are positive, constructive and polite to others in their contributions and so the Forum is, in my view, as useful and important as the numbers database.  There are sometimes lively debates and disagreements but that is healthy.   Long may it continue.
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Campaignagainstripofftelecoms  
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CJT-80
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Re: A plea to 0870
Reply #7 - Apr 21st, 2013 at 6:26pm
 
Hi there loddon,

I'd like to point out that I agree that this site is invaluable, and I like you have a fair amount of input into it.

Dave and the rest of the contributors make this site what it is.  It's a wealth of information, and effective alternatives to 084/087/080 based numbers.

I will continue to contribute as and when I can to it's ongoing work.

Apologies to anyone if my previous comments appeared to suggest the work of this site or it's members were negative.

Smiley
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Regards,

CJT-80

Any comments made are my own and are not those of SayNoTo0870.com
 
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NGMsGhost
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Re: A plea to 0870
Reply #8 - May 30th, 2013 at 10:36pm
 
A long time ago I suggested to our main forum moderator (Dave) and the erstwhile but now highly illusive owner of this website (a certain Mr Daniel - who not even Dave has had the pleasure of meeting or even speaking to on the phone as far as I know even though I think he did once do a Radio 4 interview about the website) that anyone contributing a number to this website should have an account and own that number and all the other numbers they contribute and be reminded from time to time of what they had provided and revise it if necessary.  This was at the same time as I suggested that it was unrealistic to expect all number contributed by site users to be "Verified" by the moderators before appearing on the list as this only caused an eternal very long backlog before numbers were listed.

My comments were successful in bringing about the ability to contribute a new number that immediately appeared as an Unverified number listing but unsuccessful in terms of my insistence that new numbers were only contributed by registered forum members who could then be conracted from time to confirm the currency of the alternative numbers and/or asked to provide replacements if known.  Of course the situation is a bit more complicated than I suggest as if one person has contributed an alternative number and then stops visiting the site completely but a new member comes along who knows a new alternative number we do not want to stop them contributing that new alternative.

The numbers list is now inevitably unfortunately massively inaccurate thanks to the ending of revenue share on 0870 numbers with the consequence that most 0870 numbers gradually converted to an 0844 number.  There has also been no program to go through the 0870 numbers and test them and find a replacement where the 0870 number is defunct.  This could not be done on an automated basis as unless a human calls the line how could we be sure it is actually being answered by a useful service and not an automated message to call another number.

Basically we now lack guidance, vision or any form of constructive dialogue at all with the site owner (Daniel - - who sometimes used to post in the forum but now almost never does) who I imagine earns some kind of income from this website given the very large number of daily visits it has and the various commercial advertising links to other sites.

It is a great sadness that the founder of this website is so unproactive in terms of ideas to improve ownership and maintenance of the numbers by those who contributed them and in so doing also to ensure some kind of program of regular active maintenance and housekeeping.

I do notice that Dave whilst from time time criticising those who complain about the quality of the numbers really does nothing to try and bring in more active helpers to maintain them.  For instance this site and its forum has been going for almost 10 years but there has never been a single attempt to have a social get together for anyone who wants to attend at least once a year.   I know not everybody could attend as many live a long way from London but at least there would be an opportunity tio do so and some kind of real community would be formed.

As it is the Alternatives list can only be regarded as containing a list of possible numbers when calling a company, of which one might work.  If you then need to call that company regularly that is still pretty helpful in terms of avoiding the 084/7 numbers.

Perhaps it is unfortunate that some of the numbers were elevated to verified status because these days often the unverified number is more likely to be inaccurate than the newer unverified numbers for all but the verty largest companies (where the alternatives tend to be more actively maintained due to user feedback).

So those are my thoughts on the matter.  The list of alternative numbers could be a lot better than it is but it is unlikely to become so without a major proactive effort by the owner of this website.

Also these problems are endemic to the business of alternative numbers of itself as the Spanish website www.nomasnumeros900.com has many of the same issues as this website with numbers that once worked becoming out of date.

The last press interview by Daniel - was one in the FT in October 2005..  See http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/3109ea42-3799-11da-af40-00000e2511c8.html#axzz2UoYphqj...

However he is still the currently registered owner of this domain and is clearly taking no chances by recently having renewed it for another 10 years.
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« Last Edit: May 31st, 2013 at 7:07am by Forum Admin »  

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