This was mentioned last night on Real Radio Yorkshire's news. It was very brief and just said that GP surgeries are switching to "more expensive" 0844 numbers. They have longer news bulletins at 1pm and 6.30pm where they have extended reports and I hope that they will do a follow-up on this.

I think that this Times (and others) have certainly got the ball rolling.

There are really two aspects that must be reported:

1. Cost to callers, whether they be UK landline, mobile or public phone box.
2. Difficulty for calls to be made from overseas.

idb wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2007 at 11:03pm:


Really a better article than the one in The Times because it is harder hitting and a lot stronger on saying "this is wrong and should not be happening".

But obviously still missing the key point about the exclusion of these calls from fixed price calling plans on landlines and mobiles so that the real difference is up to 40p per minute on a mobile vs zero p per minute on a mobile if that call was part of a bundle allowance of say 500 minutes per month.

More comments by readers of The Times :---

That is absolutely disgusting behaviour. Patients don't ring the doctor unless they absolutely have to.

ARK, Norwich, UK

I'm thinking of getting an 0845 number installed at home. Registering the number with all my banks, building societies, do a load of online insurance quotes and quote my phone number.
When the phone starts ringing, and all their call centres start mithering me with products they wish to sell, I'll answer and tell them to hang on a second...
and watch the money roll in.

Richard Garland, Manchester, Greater Manchester

Not so long ago we could turn up for an appointment without booking, and therefore without any cost to the patient....!

I have today spent 19 minutes on hold to the 0844 number of my doctor's surgery. This is on top of the 8 minutes I spent on hold last Monday and the 7 minutes I spent on hold last Wednesday. I then spent between 1 and 2 minutes making my arrangements. This huge telephony expense shows lack of consideration of the patients at a time when GPs are handsomely rewarded

Rip off Britain at work again using the smokescreen which phone companies have used by quoting huge amounts of variable information about different charges. It works for the phone companies now it will work for the GPs. I detect the work of "managers" put in place to run a business and damn the patient.. Note the comment by DHM: If hospitals can fleece the patients why shouldnt the GP. These people are in the "care" industry, remuneration for GPs has gone up in advance of inflation but greed still drives some of them to further excess.

mike gee, bournemouth, uk

They now have an answer machine at my surgery, so instead of a engaged tone, the call is connected only to inform you that the lines are too busy and to try again. So I am paying for the privilege of being told I cannot speak to anybody. It's a farce!

Dan, London,

Just another way to rip off the longsuffering taxpayer - GPs are extremely well rewarded for doing less work that they have in the past

What old days you could never get through, I have never rung my Doctors without taking half a day to get through and then you are always put on hold I spent so long on the telephone thet B.T.suggested it for my family and friends numbers. What B.T. also forgot to mention is the minimum amount per call I can call anyone for an hour for 5p on evening and weekends (when Doctors are closed) but If I talk for 20 seconds it cost 5p and don't for get the VAT. What it does is penalize the sick. Who has tried to live on sickness benefit, I think they think because you are sick you do not need everyday thinks like Gas, electric Water and a house to live in, you know what most of your money goes on!

June Hart, Hockley Essex, U.K

08xx numbers are a racket. The so called 0845 local access numbers to 'save' money for callers is a nonsense for those with mobiles. Companies and organisations should be required by law to offer a national landline number if they have an 08xx number . To get through to my bank I have to use the international number on my mobile should I wish to call without charge. Does the bank know the issues this creates? Most definitely, but it is not in their financial interest to do anything about it.


At least we should be given the choice; to call a local number at less cost to the patient

More comments on The Times website ;---

GPs and the iniquitous company NEG ARE "out to fleece their patients". NEG are out to make excessive profits out of sick people who are calling a health service. Calls to 0844 are always more costly. The public should be able to choose whether to call a premium rate or a normal number when calling an essential service such as a doctor.

Mike Kelly, Reading

If I call a doctor’s surgery that uses normal telephone numbers (01 or 02) it usually costs 3p/min, but as I pay my phone company an extra £10 a month, all my 01 and 02 calls are “free�.
If my doctor was using one of those dreadful 0844 numbers, the call would cost me 5p/min at all times, and they would receive about half of my call charges as a extra fee.

I would change my doctor.

kevin kearney, Liverpool,

To say that the 0844 number gives the advantage of a single contact number is disingenuous. The same can be achieved with an 01 or 02 number.

PaulK, Thornton

think it is terrible that the GPs surgeries telephone area code will cease and we will need to use 0844 numbers which are more expensive. It is already hard for pensioners to manage on their limited income and they are the ones who need the doctors most. Not fair on the other people who live on shoestring budgets either. It should not be allowed.

Lee To, Swindon, UK

It is shocking that even GP's are now ripping off consumers by using these types of numbers. It certainly isn't fair !!

JB, Manchester

Can I echo the earlier contributor and ask when the Times is going to do a story about the vast cost to the NHS of mobile calls?

Patients lack of a fixed line is costing the NHS millions as hospital secretaries, midwives, distict nurses and family doctors are forced to phone mobile numbers a huge costs compared to a local call.

I am also a GP and the costs of phone bills has risen more than any other cost in the last few years, mainly due to the large number of calls we have to make to mobiles.

Perhaps patients who do not have a fixed line should not expect to be phoned by their health care workers

Dr Trefor Roscoe, Sheffield,

My landline calls are free as I subscribe to Option 3. I pay 2p per minute to call one daughter in Hong Kong and 1 p to call another in Canada. It seems ridiculous to have to pay more to call my doctor down the road.

Stephanie McKenzie-Hill, Uckfield,

I pay a flat rate of £23.49 a month which gives me all 01 and 02 numbers 24/7 and includes the phone line rental. It used to be a good deal. Now more and more companies use 0870, and 084 numbers, and I have to pay for these calls on top. Why do they do it? There is only one answer. Greed.
Doctors should not be allowed to use these 0844 numbers. If I phone my surgery, which is an hour's walk away, it is only because I have to. There is no bus going there, and I don't own a car. Incidentally my surgery hasn't treated me in the past 3 years at all. Do they refuse to collect the allowance they get for having me on their List?
Beryl, WINDSOR, England


Sorry, but I couldn't understand why the change of numbers have occurred: were the doctors offered new mobile phones with the new prefix?

Bernardo, QUELUZ, Portugal

So why do GPs do it?
As the article states, the GPs pay for the installation of the system. This will run to thousands, so any suggestion of GPs profiteering from this system seems misplaced.
Maybe, just maybe, they are trying to provide their patients with better access to the surgery by phone.
I guess we could always go back to the old days when you could never get through. I suspect the same people moaning now were moaning equally vociferously then.

Simon, Poole,
The use of 0844 without providing a geographic alternative number is truly a scandal. It significant that Ofcom say "that use of the numbers by public sector bodies was “not appropriate� and there were cheaper options".
Surely, doctors must be compelled to provide an alternative geographic number to 0844 - otherwise this is another stealth tax on the public and a tax on the old and sick in particular!!


Mike Kelly, Reading

loddon wrote on Jul 24^th, 2007 at 9:29am:


Would that be the same single access number that improves safety from overseas by either blocking all access to your doctor and/or turning it into a £1 per minute call?

Why does this doctor or NEG rep (he is claarly one of the two) not explain why they cannot use an 01/02 voip geographic number that can be redirected anywhere they want it to.

I have allways found doctors to be arrogant individuals who dictate to you as though you are a naughty pupil rarher than treating you as a valued customer who might take your business elsewhere if the service is not what customers want.

Speaking of which I would urge anyone with an NEG 0844 doctors surgery to move elsewhere and to make a point to the national newspapers that this is why they have chosen to do so.  However if another doctor refuses to take you on because you are moving to avoid 0844 then you should publicise that to a national newspaper and to the highest level of the NHS's official complaints procedure (which ends at the Parliamentary Ombudsman).

I cannot find any public comments on The Telegraph website.  Do they have a facility for comment on their articles?   I cannot find it.

The Telegraph article also quotes Ofcon :---

"However, the telcoms watchdog, Ofcom, has said it is not appropriate for public sector organisations to use the more expensive phone lines. "

Also :----

"Joyce Robins, co-director of Patient Concern, said: “It is quite ridiculous. People should not pay more for their calls to their GP. I thought this had been stopped by the Government, but they have obviously found a loophole. "
“It can be very difficult to get through to your surgery in some cases and you can run up quite a bill.”

And NEG :---

"Scott Russell, of telephone service provider Network Europe Group (NEG), said that patients spent on average three and a half minutes less on the phone when calling the Surgery Line system.
He said it does not cost patients any more to make the call, it simply removes some of the profits made by the call providers."

So Neg rake off the profits instead of some other 'call provider' ... and that makes it quite alright then??!!!  NEG can perpetrate a rip off with impunity because they are only diverting the ill-gotten gains from another exploitative greedy phone company.  Ofcon surely must do something about this outrage now.