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NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investigation (Read 512,205 times)
NonGeographicalMan
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #75 - Aug 2nd, 2005 at 1:00am
 
Quote:
It does not matter what Patientline charge - they are the cheapest that were willing to provide the service! If you would like to provide cheaper calls to patients you need to either argue directly with Patientline or set up your own company!

No I don't I need to set up my own firm I need the NHS to know what they are signing up for and refuse to accept the use of PNS for a non PNS application and to instead only allow 0871 at worst.  If the NHS knew what they were signing up to a better deal would then have come forward.

And I need the NHS to take a more pragmatic approach to mobile phone use and create rooms in hospital where they can be used safely away from patient equipment.

And as PieldeSap has highlighted we will soon all be on free wifi access that will be allowed in hospitals as the emissions levels are far lower.  Since Voip to Voip has no phone charges at that point its a case of bang bang Patientline you're dead.  It couldn't happen to a nicer guy than the former head of the prison service.  Perhaps his previous professional expertise meant he was experienced in knowing how to exploit captive customers. Cheesy
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« Last Edit: Aug 2nd, 2005 at 1:53am by N/A »  
 
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idb
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #76 - Aug 2nd, 2005 at 2:33pm
 
Another media article:

here

<<
Patients and relatives at two Norfolk hospitals could be freed from "blackmail" phone charges, thanks to an investigation by a government watchdog.

Relatives are being charged up to 16 times the cost of a standard BT call to contact loved-ones at the Norfolk and Norwich University Hospital and the Queen Elizabeth Hospital, King's Lynn.

Patients themselves pay out three times more than on a home phone to use bedside handsets, and as much as £3.50 a day to watch television on individual screens.

But now the charges - branded "blackmail" by Norwich North MP Ian Gibson - could be slashed because of an investigation by Ofcom, which regulates phone and television services.

The watchdog says Patientline, the firm that runs the service, could be breaking competition laws because of high charges for dialling in to hospitals and the use of recorded messages at the start of calls that ramp up the cost.

Ofcom is also concerned about the length and the exclusive nature of deals struck between hospitals and the firm.

The worries are backed up by a NHS-commissioned report quietly released in March which found 90pc of patients rated the cost of incoming calls as expensive, with 62pc saying the same for outgoing calls. The study found that patients in hospital for a week racked up average bills of £46.98, even before taking into account the cost of relatives' calls.

Mobile phone use is banned in most hospital areas because of the risk of interference with lifesaving equipment.

Dr Gibson said: "I have always thought that patients were being fleeced, and I am glad something is being done about it.

"It is absolutely disgraceful that people are being ripped off. When people are in hospital they have enough to worry about without this big expense.

"People want to know how their loved ones are and they might be phoning several times a day. They are almost being blackmailed."

Dr Gibson said he would write to Ofcom to pass on dozens of complaints from constituents about the charges.

Patients' Association chairman Michael Summers has also backed the inquiry.

"Overall it will be beneficial to patients to have bedside telephone and television facilities, but it should not be at any price," he said.

"You have a captive audience of patients, many of whom are elderly, and in many cases those trying to contact them may be elderly themselves. In many cases calls to America or Australia would cost less."

But Patientline boss Derek Lewis said the inquiry would "vindicate" the company's contracts with 155 NHS hospitals. [...]
>>
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« Last Edit: Aug 2nd, 2005 at 8:36pm by Dave »  

As from November 21, 2013, I no longer participate in the forum and am unable to receive private messages.
 
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NonGeographicalMan
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #77 - Aug 2nd, 2005 at 2:38pm
 
Quote:
But Patientline boss Derek Lewis said the inquiry would "vindicate" the company's contracts with 155 NHS hospitals. [...]
>>


It would seem that Mr Lewis unfortunately knows Ofcom only too well and is as cynical about its powers to stamp out these abuses as we are.  Especially abuses that were clearly originally endorsed and signed off at a ministerial level.
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NFH
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #78 - Aug 3rd, 2005 at 7:34pm
 
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NonGeographicalMan
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #79 - Aug 4th, 2005 at 1:25am
 
""The MHRA said mobile phones have some potential to interfere with sensitive medical devices, especially at short range," she said.

"This is because some medical devices are more susceptible to interference than others. "

I wonder if the vital medical device that is interfered with is a Patientline television and telephone station Wink
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mc661
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #80 - Aug 4th, 2005 at 5:00am
 
I remember when patientscam was installed at the Queen Elizabeth Hospital, King's Lynn.

Our group on the council tried to get a motion passed to get it removed but the good old political group in power decided to chuck it out.
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NonGeographicalMan
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #81 - Aug 4th, 2005 at 8:42am
 
Quote:
Our group on the council tried to get a motion passed to get it removed but the good old political group in power decided to chuck it out.


Surely even if your motion had been passed you would have had no power at all to control what goes on in an NHS hospital.

The current parliamentary 0870 motion is signed by MPs of all parties.

http://edmi.parliament.uk/EDMi/EDMDetails.aspx?EDMID=28872&SESSION=8 75

Although some tory MPs will favour the right of businesses with contracts to make profits those who are pro a free market and competition will recognise that 0870 and Patientscam are examples of unhealthy markets with a lack of proper competition and artificial regulation controlling those who can compete in the marketplace.

If there was proper competition then these scam prices for Patientline and 0870 would not apply.  The 01 and 02 calls market shows what competition can do when it is allowed to operate freely.
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« Last Edit: Aug 4th, 2005 at 8:44am by N/A »  
 
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Heinz
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #82 - Aug 4th, 2005 at 9:03am
 
I do like the new name - PatientScam.

SurgeryScam has a nice ring to it too.

On the other hand, my local GPs have recently moved to new surgery premises and, guess what, they installed a new telephone system using - wait for it - their old 01 number!  Marks out of ten?  TEN!
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« Last Edit: Aug 4th, 2005 at 11:45am by Heinz »  

After years of ignoring govt. guidelines & RIPPING OFF Council Tax payers using 0845 numbers, Essex County Council changed to 0345 numbers on 2 November 2015
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NonGeographicalMan
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #83 - Aug 4th, 2005 at 9:20am
 
Quote:
BTW, NGM, can you amend your above post again - any time other than 0844 would be nice!


Surely 0901 or 0906 would be far worse! Grin
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juby
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #84 - Aug 4th, 2005 at 10:55pm
 
Many years I used to work for a telephone company as a salesman, details are a bit fuzzy as it was nearly thirty years ago.

But I do remember my greatest (and only success)! It was to sell a telephone system to a large company who basically had three sites, wanted one telephone number and 1000 extensions on PMBX.

As this installation was Cross Bar/Strowger it required continuous maintenance by a full time engineer, it also needed an operator at all times although it could be switched to PABX at night. The only electronics involved were some line boosters.

All internal calls were free, (even though they could be ten miles apart) and the rental was £350 per quarter.

Not much of that system is left today, but if it could be done then why can it not be done now e.g., a 1000 bed hospital with free incoming calls to every bedside? Outgoing calls would cost three pence per minute.

I know that the answer to this is obvious, but is not the basic human right to be contacted by, or to contact, ones nearest and dearest when we are sick. It should be included in the NHS budget, not given to some outside firm to rip us off?

What other civilised country does this? Certainly none in Europe that I know about. 49 pence a minute incoming, my God!
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NonGeographicalMan
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #85 - Aug 5th, 2005 at 6:33pm
 
Quote:
What other civilised country does this? Certainly none in Europe that I know about. 49 pence a minute incoming, my God!

And in tandem with the ban on mobile use which therefore makes the thing a monopoly with no competition of any kind.

Although if what one poster said about the old wheel a payphone to the bedside system still being in place is true I would make sure to go on calling that way so as to waste as much staff time as possible and to make my point.

If everyone did this then the NHS would have to buy PatientLine out and offer normal geographic phone numbers to the modern bedside units as the NHS couldn't afford the wasted nurse time in wheeling out all those old payphones.
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BexTech
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #86 - Sep 22nd, 2005 at 6:26am
 
http://icsolihull.icnetwork.co.uk/news/local/tm_objectid=16138710%26method=full%...

A KNOWLE man angered by the hefty charges levied for calling a sick relative in Solihull Hospital has complained to telecoms regulator Ofcom.

Dr David Parry, of Tilehouse Green Lane, told the regulator the charges on his phone bill after making calls to his 85-year-old father-in-law were "grossly extortionate".

For one 17-minute call he was charged £6.58, yet as he pointed out, speaking for an hour to his daughter in the south of France cost no more than £1.

As reported in the Solihull Times, bedside phones are provided for patients in Solihull and Heartlands hospitals by a private company called Patientline, which also supplies television, radio and internet access.

Patientline, given the contract for installing the system by Heart of England NHS Foundation Trust, is under investigation by Ofcom after being accused of excessive profit-making.

Dr Parry, a 65-year-old retired industrial chemist, has written to Mark Goldman, chief executive of the trust, asking whether it was profiting from the operation.

In a written reply, Mr Goldman said Patientline owned and ran the equipment and were responsible for tariffs. "I would like to dispel any notion the hospital is profiteering from these facilities," he added.

Dr Parry said he contacted Ofcom because he thought his experience might be helpful to the investigation. "I find it amazing it costs £25 an hour to phone someone in Solihull Hospital but to call Parkway - a private hospital - costs just 30p."
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dorf
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #87 - Sep 22nd, 2005 at 10:35pm
 
Shiggaddi,

as you thought - Oftel did in fact (ONLY TEMPORARILY) prohibit revenue-sharing on 070 PNS numbers, but only to the terminating subscriber. Intermediaries are still allowed to share the revenue. So of course, as anyone with even a shortage of grey matter would realise, it did not take long for the scammers to realise that all they had to do was to nominate a dummy "terminating subscriber" and become an intermediary (although in fact they were in reality the true terminating subscriber) and hey presto they were back in business again exploiting loads of dosh on the 070 scam, which has much higher rates than 0870 or 0871!

It seem it is only the "regulators" who lack sufficient grey matter to anticipate just how easily the scammers will exploit the loop-holes which they somehow mysteriously "fail" to address in the system, just as apparently they are unable to understand that if you allow queuing on a revenue-generating call there will inevitably always be a propensity for the scammers to extrapolate call durations to get as much revenue as possible. What is so strange is that they were able to see this when they configured the New National Numbering plan, which was why they prohibited queuing on 09 numbers with revenue sharing, but suddenly their grey matter mysteriously diminished when it came to considering that the same was true with all revenue-sharing numbers like 0870, 0871 and 070 PNS! They suddenly saw the complete scenario as being totally different. I see no ships they said in their consultation, holding the telescope to their blind eye!
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Ofcom are completely ineffectual
 
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dorf
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #88 - Sep 22nd, 2005 at 10:39pm
 
It is continuing. I have noticed since I posted my last item in reply to Shagaddi here that his post seems to have vanished! This makes my reply look rather stupid.

Several of my recent posts have continued to vanish also over the last few days. Makes one wonder whether a hacker is at work here, perhaps working for Ofcom?
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Ofcom are completely ineffectual
 
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NonGeographicalMan
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Re: NHS Patientline 49p per minute Ofcom Investiga
Reply #89 - Sep 22nd, 2005 at 10:43pm
 
Quote:
I see no ships they said in their consultation, holding the telescope to their blind eye!


It is easy for those Ofcom eyes to become blind to the real truth when they have for so many years had to watch their owners snouts stuck deep in the corporate trough at the operations which they now purport to regulate.

One wonders why the Advertising Standards Authority has such tough rules to say no one previously from the advertising or direct marketing industry can work for it whilst Ofcom goes out of its way to recruit people who by definition have a direct conflict of interest with their supposed mission to work in the interests of citizens and consumers!
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« Last Edit: Sep 22nd, 2005 at 10:44pm by N/A »  
 
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